The good pastor would certainly not want to encourage that, Karen. Both, in his theology, both are pitfalls the 'wily one' has set out to draw us into the fiery pit. ;)
Hmmm. I eat salad every night, and have a glass of wine. I grow tomatoes in the summer too. I guess I am enslaved to vegetables. But I have copped to being an unrepentant heathen for years and I doubt that's going to change. I'm glad Mr Robertson won't be in whatever hereafter I wind up in, that's all.
The first step to overcoming an addiction, Karen, is admitting you have a problem. I'm sure Pastor Pat would be only too pleased to pray for your full recovery. ;)
Lorne what is the object of this post. We humans have been blessed or cursed with the ability of memory, to look forward and to reason, apparently the only species that can. Makes you wonder. I am an agnostic, I have neither the ability or need to believe and not vain enough have the surety of an atheist. Is Robertson expressing some evil, just what is it that you and other commenters find offensive. I may not find Robertson’s message of any value to me but others may and if one person is freed of a debilitating addiction, the message has purpose Norm
That is a fair question, Norm. First of all, let me say, as I have made mention elsewhere on this blog, I do believe in some ultimate Truth. What really rankles me about people like Robertson and his fellow evangelical fundamentalists is the certainty with which they pontificate about all manner of things, as if they hold the keys to the absolute Truth. To claim to know the mind of God, and what God demands is, to me, the ultimate in arrogance. Such people would not have us use our intellect to think and ponder, but only to obey.
Lorne that's fair, evangelical Christian preachers whether on TV, radio or from the pulpit do have the aura of certainty. They have a message albeit a somewhat narrow message however if their audience has a need and find solace then what is the harm to you or to me. Our civilization, our way of life, our laws even our personal beliefs are essentially the result of our Judea, Christian heritage albeit modified by exposure to others. The golden rule and 10 Commandments, or whatever number, are not exclusive to the Christian faith, they are a codification of how we should live our lives and found throughout the world in various forms. Without this foundation, which is being eroded, where would we find ourselves. We know! We see it all around us, and we feel overwhelmed by this erosion, even as we fight to maintain it.
I don't know the answers but if Pat Robertson's ministry gives meaning and direction to his many followers I see no reason to belittle his message, and not even if we have a better one. Norm
I appreciate you thoughtful comments here, Norm, but I'll just say this: I agree that each is entitled to his/her own beliefs, but it is when those beliefs stray into public policy that we have problems. We see the kinds of influence the religious right wields in the United States, and some of them make a virtue out of cruel discrimination against those who are different. An even more insidious aspect of many fundamentalists' beliefs is their view that the earth was given to us by by God, and therefore we can do what we like with it. They even go so far as to say use this in their climate denial proclamations. Take a look at this link for an illustration: : http://www.cornwallalliance.org/2009/05/01/evangelical-declaration-on-global-warming/
Lorne That is whole other dimension one we can fight against. Now you're getting into the realm of Harperism. Thanks for link I'm aware of the Cornwall Alliance and the domini mandate. I have trouble how these relate to Robertson and his attempt to " save" addicts. Norm
You have a valid point here, Norm; there are times when Robertson does no harm and perhaps some good, but if you look at his entire body of work, he has quite a mixed record. That being said, I am happy to acknowledge that, in isolation, this particular segment can be seen as positive.
I just can't watch. I'm afraid it will make me want a drink, or to take up pot smoking.
ReplyDeleteThe good pastor would certainly not want to encourage that, Karen. Both, in his theology, both are pitfalls the 'wily one' has set out to draw us into the fiery pit. ;)
DeleteTime to light up a joint.
ReplyDeleteShhh... Pamela, please don't let Pastor Pat hear that kind of talk! ;)
DeleteHmmm. I eat salad every night, and have a glass of wine. I grow tomatoes in the summer too. I guess I am enslaved to vegetables. But I have copped to being an unrepentant heathen for years and I doubt that's going to change. I'm glad Mr Robertson won't be in whatever hereafter I wind up in, that's all.
ReplyDeleteThe first step to overcoming an addiction, Karen, is admitting you have a problem. I'm sure Pastor Pat would be only too pleased to pray for your full recovery. ;)
DeleteLorne what is the object of this post. We humans have been blessed or cursed with the ability of memory, to look forward and to reason, apparently the only species that can. Makes you wonder. I am an agnostic, I have neither the ability or need to believe and not vain enough have the surety of an atheist.
ReplyDeleteIs Robertson expressing some evil, just what is it that you and other commenters find offensive.
I may not find Robertson’s message of any value to me but others may and if one person is freed of a debilitating addiction, the message has purpose
Norm
That is a fair question, Norm. First of all, let me say, as I have made mention elsewhere on this blog, I do believe in some ultimate Truth. What really rankles me about people like Robertson and his fellow evangelical fundamentalists is the certainty with which they pontificate about all manner of things, as if they hold the keys to the absolute Truth. To claim to know the mind of God, and what God demands is, to me, the ultimate in arrogance. Such people would not have us use our intellect to think and ponder, but only to obey.
DeleteLorne that's fair, evangelical Christian preachers whether on TV, radio or from the pulpit do have the aura of certainty. They have a message albeit a somewhat narrow message however if their audience has a need and find solace then what is the harm to you or to me. Our civilization, our way of life, our laws even our personal beliefs are essentially the result of our Judea, Christian heritage albeit modified by exposure to others. The golden rule and 10 Commandments, or whatever number, are not exclusive to the Christian faith, they are a codification of how we should live our lives and found throughout the world in various forms. Without this foundation, which is being eroded, where would we find ourselves. We know! We see it all around us, and we feel overwhelmed by this erosion, even as we fight to maintain it.
DeleteI don't know the answers but if Pat Robertson's ministry gives meaning and direction to his many followers I see no reason to belittle his message, and not even if we have a better one.
Norm
I appreciate you thoughtful comments here, Norm, but I'll just say this: I agree that each is entitled to his/her own beliefs, but it is when those beliefs stray into public policy that we have problems. We see the kinds of influence the religious right wields in the United States, and some of them make a virtue out of cruel discrimination against those who are different. An even more insidious aspect of many fundamentalists' beliefs is their view that the earth was given to us by by God, and therefore we can do what we like with it. They even go so far as to say use this in their climate denial proclamations. Take a look at this link for an illustration:
Delete: http://www.cornwallalliance.org/2009/05/01/evangelical-declaration-on-global-warming/
Lorne That is whole other dimension one we can fight against. Now you're getting into the realm of Harperism. Thanks for link I'm aware of the Cornwall Alliance and the domini mandate. I have trouble how these relate to Robertson and his attempt to " save" addicts.
DeleteNorm
You have a valid point here, Norm; there are times when Robertson does no harm and perhaps some good, but if you look at his entire body of work, he has quite a mixed record. That being said, I am happy to acknowledge that, in isolation, this particular segment can be seen as positive.
Delete